tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25555967.post114790112924057420..comments2024-02-09T08:07:26.090-08:00Comments on Dodgy At Best: Heartbreak. Absolute Heartbreak.Kanuhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02959256951835399304noreply@blogger.comBlogger14125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25555967.post-1148059725360339822006-05-19T10:28:00.000-07:002006-05-19T10:28:00.000-07:00In regards to the send-off, soccer laws separate o...In regards to the send-off, soccer laws separate offenses into two categories, fouls and misconducts. The referee could have applied advantage to the take-down "foul" and therefore allowed the goal to stand. He could then go back and issue a card for the "misconduct" committed by Lehmann. <BR/><BR/>At that point, the decision between red and yellow would have to be made. Lehmann was the last defender on an obvious goal-scoring opportunity, so he still could have been given a red card, leaving it 10 on 11 with Barca up 1-0. However, with the goal being scored, it is more likely he simply would be shown the yellow and allowed to continue.<BR/><BR/>In the end, it is hard to say who this hurt more... Barca who lost their opportunity for a goal, or Arsenal who had to play their backup keeper who let through what should have been a rather routine stop.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25555967.post-1148018895185369432006-05-18T23:08:00.000-07:002006-05-18T23:08:00.000-07:00Thanks Adriano. I'm glad that after witnessing so...Thanks Adriano. I'm glad that after witnessing some not so great Arsenal performances this season, you got to see the real Arsenal tonight, the ones that seem to play so well when they are totally up against it. I'm also glad that you got a glimpse of what Freddy looked like between 1998-2003,, and that you got to see that Ashely Cole is the best ledt back in the world. Period. Final thoughts tomorrow and then it's time to move on.<BR/><BR/>Are you going to switch your handle to A7 for the World Cup?Kanuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02959256951835399304noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25555967.post-1147996240137661162006-05-18T16:50:00.000-07:002006-05-18T16:50:00.000-07:00I have not read any of the comments or have read t...I have not read any of the comments or have read the full post by Kanu. The reason is I want, as requested and also compelled, to give a neutral opinion about the match. Italian soccer is my arena. Inter my team. We have Flares, Ultras, small motor vehicles (Vespas) being tossed from stadio second levels, and yes those f’n Juve Milan fixers. <BR/>The Champions League final is meant, as many finals are, to be the ultimate meeting between the “Best” Two teams. A lot of nay sayers attacked Arsenal’s side saying that this would be a one sided affair and Barcelona would triumph simply on paper and no further discussion. They said Arsenal didn’t belong and this Cinderella story had to end. Ding dong Midnight is here! <BR/> But the clock struck 18’ and a decision had to be made. The rule is what the rule is. The red card was shown and away Lehman goes. I don’t care to focus on that because many times I feel that excuses take away from many other crucial points and junctures in a game. These points where teams are unable to capitalize should be addressed and the team stand to be judged for the sum total of minutes they play. I hate having to point to a single point in time to make excuse up for 90+ minutes of play. The announcers saying that this should have been a goal and leave the field level at 11 is, in my opinion, messing with rules that are very cut and dry. Exceptions have no place in making the game a “Better Match” (sure sounds like an ESPN statement).<BR/> However, I also did not like the calls “anticipated” by the referees. A lot of clean ball tackles were called fouls. A lot of tackles went unpunished. That yellow card must have felt neglected. Henry is Henry (God only knows what he was yelling at Wenger). Ashley Cole, I would like to say, played his friggin’ heart out last night. Ljungberg looked as if he was not to be denied and wanted the team and fans on his back. Believe me he could have handled it. You could see the heart in Arsenal there was a lot to carry last night.<BR/> On Barca’s side I would have to say that there was a bit of complacency when they started the match. Sol Cambell’s header shocked Barca, and shook the stadium as it tilted in favor of the Gunnars. At the half Arsenal even with 10 men I thought had the heart to carry them through but I felt the leg’s to carry them might tire. Barca had some thinking to do. Slowly but surely the attackers became the hunted. Arsenal tired and Barca poured on the pressure. But damn those referees for slighting the tackles by making them insignificant fouls. Sorry ok back to Barca. Ronaldinho was trying to make things out of thin air as he usually does. But last night it wasn’t the same R10. It looked like he was looking for calls instead of “Moving Forward”. I felt the man on a mission was Giuly and then when he came on Larssen. Pushing forward but never trying to nail the 35 yarder. Dean Cain (Deco) tried to flop his way to a penalty late as the “man of making a meal” tried to no avail. I’ve seen yellow cards handed out for that. Still the yellow card continues to whimper “Let Me Out”. I felt like they were determined to motivate this less than energetic Barca offense and played with the urgency necessary to get them back on track. Eto’o got his and it was a nice shot (Short side) but this second string goalie couldn’t close out? Goalkeeping 101 is close out and reduce the shooting angle. Defenders do play back into the goal as a goalie moves toward an impending attack. Don’t they? <BR/> The nutmeg heard round the world….. Close your legs. And a side note where was Reyes? <BR/>All in all the refereeing was lopsided and shotty at best. I would say that the Gunnars got the short end of the stick in that respect. Arsenal had their chances to score and so did Barca. Each held responsible for their missed opportunities. Sometimes numbers don’t lie (11 on 10). For 70 plus minutes 10 on 11 is an endurance match that is hard to win. It was a good and exciting game but not in the way I wanted. I’m sure a lot of people felt the same way. At least no one is screaming food poisoning. Friggin Spurs. My condolences Kanu. <BR/><BR/>I apologize that this post may be separate flows but a need to get it out in between the literal 12 meetings I had today may be the cause for some disconnect. <BR/><BR/>A10Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25555967.post-1147979709186058622006-05-18T12:15:00.000-07:002006-05-18T12:15:00.000-07:00Humility? From Barca? You kid yourself. Mourinho w...Humility? From Barca? You kid yourself. Mourinho would find his tact before Barca comes anywhere close to humility.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25555967.post-1147971300967881442006-05-18T09:55:00.000-07:002006-05-18T09:55:00.000-07:00I think the rule has something to do with stopping...I think the rule has something to do with stopping a clear goal-scoring opportunity, which, I would guess, means that if you let Giuly score the goal, Lehmann wouldn't have done. The problem is that once he blows the whistle, he's got no choice--if players on either team let up, there's no option short of a red that is fair in that instance. <BR/><BR/>Initially, I was pleased at the red card/no goal as opposed to the 11 men/0-1. But, in retrospect, it really killed the game as a contest. And, given the amount of fight that the Arsenal showed (and Almunia making plain his obvious limitations) I think the latter would have been a far better option. Which is easy to say now, of course. <BR/><BR/>Amazingly, I think if any other player had been sent off on 18 minutes (outside of Toure and Eboue, perhaps), Arsenal could have won this match. But losing Jens was too much. <BR/><BR/>The worst part about losing, for me, was the attitude of the Barcelona team, and the media, in the days leading up to the game (by which, I mean Rijkaard's comments about the gameplanning, the comments regarding TH14's future, Cesc's past, and anything said by the useless 'Gio'). Arsenal played them 10 v. 11 for close to an hour--and had outscored them--before fatigue set in. Perhaps a little humility is in order on their part.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25555967.post-1147969449147558032006-05-18T09:24:00.000-07:002006-05-18T09:24:00.000-07:00Oh, and I forgot to mention this:After all of that...Oh, and I forgot to mention this:<BR/><BR/>After all of that frustration for Henry, the referee booked Henry for a totally clean tackle where he got the ball. A total joke.<BR/><BR/>Now that I write all of these out, maybe I'm back on board that the refereeing was poor.<BR/><BR/>I would like to know definitively what the referees options were on the sending off. My understanding of the 'last man' rule is that by rule he had to be sent off, so the options were either no whistle/no foul, or whistle, red card. Yet people are talking about how he should have given Mats a yellow and let the goal stand, but was this even an option for him? I think not, but lots are talking like this was an option. Maybe later I'll take some time to research it properly. If anyone knows the definitive answer and can source it, please throw it up here for me. Thanks.Kanuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02959256951835399304noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25555967.post-1147969171383945352006-05-18T09:19:00.000-07:002006-05-18T09:19:00.000-07:00Solon-Tom over at Arseblog says that Ash Cole play...Solon-<BR/><BR/>Tom over at Arseblog says that Ash Cole played Eto'o onside on the red card incident:<BR/><BR/>http://arseblog.com/WP/?p=40<BR/><BR/>Maybe on Sky or BBC or ITV or whatever they had they got some different angles then we got...Kanuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02959256951835399304noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25555967.post-1147968318761516522006-05-18T09:05:00.000-07:002006-05-18T09:05:00.000-07:00After watching the replay last night I took down m...After watching the replay last night I took down my comments about the refereeing being one sided. Henry sure was pissed, and part of me can see why while part of me cannot. Titi's frustration began early when he won the ball in the corner with a clean, shoulder-down shrugging off of I believe Marquez, turned and had the ball in space, and was called for a foul. Then Marquez certainly should have been booked in the 24th minute for his late challenge on Henry - Henry was visibly upset, as this was just after the red card and Eboue getting a yellow (which was deserved). As Henry said in his interview "playing me when on a yellow is a whole different thing" (paraphrased), and he feels like if Marquez had a yellow with 66 minutes to go things might have been different, especially when Marquez challenged him in the air harshly towards the end of the game. Then at the end of the half Henry shot over the bar, it was very clearly deflected by a Barca boot, and the referee hgave a goal kick - a very incompetent call for both him and the linesman to miss. There was a late challenge by Van Bronkhorst on someone in the 2nd half that should have been a yellow card and was not given, and then Deco's dive outside the box int he 2nd half should have been a yellow. It's not just me & Th14 who thought this - on all 3 the ESPN commentators stated that they definitely should have been yellow cards. SO I think he is right to feel frustrated, but a the same time the foul that led to Arsenal's goal was pretty soft (although in real time it looked much less so), so it is hard for me persoanlly to say that this was the difference in the game. But he & the team are right to feel that Barca, up 11 men to 10, had 3 very clear yellow card offenses that were not given in accordance with your unwritten rule #2 . Bottom line for Henry is that he has 2 1-on-1s with Valdes and scored neither. He scored even one of those and Arsenal most likely do not lose.<BR/><BR/>Eto'o may have been behind the 2 defenders on his side, but I think he was played onside by the defender on the far side of the box. Either way it certainly is not definitive, so Wenger et. al should stop talking like it was clear cut - hopefully after they see the replays they will.<BR/><BR/>Yeah, there is no definitive replay of the Eto'o break that led to the red card, but I he was probably onside. Given that they showed replays of all 3 goals from an "eye in the sky cam", you would think that they could have shown the most important moment of the match from the same camera angle.<BR/><BR/>At the end of the day, Arsenal were brave, valiant, courageous, but it was not enough. Henry had 3 good chances, Hleb just missed, and Ljungburg had a great chance. Is they convert just one of these they win, that's just how it goes sometimes.<BR/><BR/>This morning I thought about how gutted I would be if Arsenal had finished 5th in the league, and CL qualification for next year was riding on yesterday outcome, and things turned out the way they did. Made me feel a little bit better about things. If Henry stays (or even if he goes to Barca and Arsenal get Eto'o in return) there is no reason to believe that Wenger cannot get them back to a CL Final in the next 5 years.Kanuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02959256951835399304noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25555967.post-1147964849532164212006-05-18T08:07:00.000-07:002006-05-18T08:07:00.000-07:00A couple of thoughts: I'm not sure I agree with TH...A couple of thoughts: <BR/><BR/>I'm not sure I agree with TH14's statements about Hauge, or disagree with Kanu, but...<BR/><BR/>(1) There's an unwritten rule in soccer that you don't send off players in a cup final. There's a story about Cruyff getting booked early in the 1974 WC Final (I think), and when someone asked him about being worried about getting sent off he responded with incredulity with something along the lines of, "I'd never get sent off in a final." Argentina was similarly aggrieved when Monson was sent off in the 1990 WC Final (although I think most neutrals were probably excited that Argentina had not won the World Cup, given their style of play that year).<BR/><BR/>(2) There's another unwritten rule that when a player is sent off, the team that has the numerical edge is tracked more closely than the team that has 10 men. This unquestionably was not the case. <BR/><BR/>(3) If you watch the replay of the incident with the sending off, it appears that Toure lets up on the play just before Giuly puts it in the net. Not that he could have stopped him from scoring--certainly his odds of doing so would have been something like 5-10%--but it's pretty clear he heard the whistle and gave up on the play. No point here, really, except that once the whistle is blown in that situation you've really got one option as a referee. <BR/><BR/>(4) I think Wenger is off on his claim that the first Barca goal was offside, Eto'o clearly appears to be level. I've seen goals disallowed for less, but it's not clear one way or another. <BR/><BR/>(5) The stronger claim for offside might be made for when Eto'o broke through on goal, leading to the red card. The ESPN2 feed did a closeup of Ronaldhino right before he passed the ball and all of their replays were of Lehmann grabbing Eto'o, so it's impossible to tell for certain--but I've never seen anyone outside of Henry break free like that (there have been a million times where I've seen Henry do it, each time I think he's off, and then the replay shows him level). None of the Arsenal defenders called for it, though, leading me to think he was onside. Has anyone seen a decent replay?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25555967.post-1147960860633116242006-05-18T07:01:00.000-07:002006-05-18T07:01:00.000-07:00Condolences. That's all a fan can say to one fan r...Condolences. That's all a fan can say to one fan right now.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25555967.post-1147920247725171742006-05-17T19:44:00.000-07:002006-05-17T19:44:00.000-07:00The lesson to the comparison to Bayern? Arsenal wi...The lesson to the comparison to Bayern? Arsenal will win it all in 2 years.<BR/><BR/>In all seriousness, if Henry stays, and given the performance of the rest of the squad (especially in the CL), I think Arsenal will celebrate the opening season of Emirates Stadium with something special.<BR/><BR/>Apparently, Henry kinda went off on the ref as well as Puyol and Marquez in the post match press conference. Slight better sign for Arsenal, when you go after Puyol, you are less likely to join Barca.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25555967.post-1147914152563030292006-05-17T18:02:00.000-07:002006-05-17T18:02:00.000-07:00Moin-The other thing that Bayern fans had to fall ...Moin-<BR/><BR/>The other thing that Bayern fans had to fall back on after that 1999 shock defeat is that before 1999 they had been to the final 5 times and won the trophy 3 times. So they could still walk around knowing that they were 3 time European Champions. Additionally, they then went on to win the Champions League again in 2001.<BR/><BR/>Overall I think a bit more gutting for Arsenal, having never even been to the final before, let alone won it.Kanuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02959256951835399304noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25555967.post-1147909574682135782006-05-17T16:46:00.000-07:002006-05-17T16:46:00.000-07:00I am gutted, although I certainly am proud of the ...I am gutted, although I certainly am proud of the lads for how well they played against all odds.<BR/><BR/>Yes, that must have sucked for Bayern fans in 1999. But that was a double lightning strike, it was out of the blue and happened so fast that they were just left in shock. A comparison to death would be heart attack or massive stroke - unexpected, out of the blue, shocking.<BR/><BR/>This was a different kind of horrible. Watching them slowly but surely get worn down and then perishing. Death comparison would be cancer or leukemia, which slowly sucks the life out of you and there's nothing you can do about it.<BR/><BR/>(those are just examples - I am NOT comparing the bummer of a sports team losing to the actual anguish experienced when a freind or family member perishes. Just using the example for descriptive sake.)Kanuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02959256951835399304noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-25555967.post-1147909067679955622006-05-17T16:37:00.000-07:002006-05-17T16:37:00.000-07:00Far be it for me to say that you should not feel g...Far be it for me to say that you should not feel gutted and all. But I'd imagine the sense of pride you are feeling at the moment at least somewhat tides things a bit.<BR/><BR/>Just imagine how bad it was for the Bayern Munich fans in 2000. Up 1-0 at going into injury time only to have 2 scramble corner goals go in over 100 secs to lose it. THAT is about as bad as I can imagine.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com